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sshaarda
Senior Member
3335 Posts |
 Posted - 03/23/2012 : 5:01:05 PM
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Just got my March 14th SAFMC newsletter and tucked away at the very end of it is this:
"other options in the scoping document, including an increase in the size limit for hogfish and gray triggerfish, a recreational tag program for deepwater species, and prohibitions on the use of powerhead gear by divers may be addressed at a later date. Stock assessments for hogfish and gray triggerfish are scheduled for 2013. The council will seek input from it's advisory panels and Scientific and Statistical Committee during the developement of CEBA 3 and public hearings will be scheduled for August 2012.
Pretty soon, it will all be gone. All of our freedom and rights are slowly being taken away from us.
"If the Arabs put down their weapons today, there would be no more violence. If the Jews put down their weapons today, there would be no more Israel ." Benjamin Netanyahu
Ecclesiastes 10:2
GW 205
F200 Yam |
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skinneej
Prolific Poster
11907 Posts |
Posted - 03/23/2012 : 5:18:33 PM
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| Did anyone pick up on the fact that they are talking about increasing the size limit BEFORE the stock assessment in 2013 even comes out? How do they make decisions BEFORE the data comes out? I thought that was the whole point of doing the stock assessment!!! |
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skinneej
Prolific Poster
11907 Posts |
Posted - 03/23/2012 : 5:20:06 PM
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| Also, do you have a link to the original document? |
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skinneej
Prolific Poster
11907 Posts |
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skinneej
Prolific Poster
11907 Posts |
Posted - 03/23/2012 : 5:30:28 PM
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You also forgot this tidbit:
2) the use of marine protected areas to help protect speckled hind and warsaw grouper
MORE MPA's?!?!?!?
1) Have they done any study to show that the existing MPA's are working?
2) Harvest of both these species is ALREADY PROHIBITED in federal waters...
3) Has there even been a stock assessment of speckled hind or warsaw since the last set of regulations (prohibition) was passed?
How can they justify more MPA's?
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Edited by - skinneej on 03/23/2012 5:31:05 PM |
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marshgrass
Senior Member
1422 Posts |
Posted - 03/23/2012 : 5:31:49 PM
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I can't say I am opposed to a limit on Triggers or Sheepies. But it should be reasonable. Not what they have done with the seabass. 10 of either is agracious plenty. Length of 14" JMHO
Marsha
35 Contender |
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skinneej
Prolific Poster
11907 Posts |
Posted - 03/23/2012 : 5:50:03 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by marshgrass
I can't say I am opposed to a limit on Triggers or Sheepies. But it should be reasonable. Not what they have done with the seabass. 10 of either is agracious plenty. Length of 14" JMHO
Marsha
35 Contender
I'm not opposed to a minimum size limit either Marsh, but how do you guys always play hide and seek behind the science when it's obvious that the science is not leading your decisions?
People are getting sick of it. You have been on the council, you know that they have had a woody for MPA's for 2 decades now and they are just looking for any excuse to put them in place... It's not objective science at all. It's nothing more than Waugh and Cupka trying to live out their wildest fisheries fantasies, and make a name for themselves even if it is at the stake of the rest of us... |
Edited by - skinneej on 03/23/2012 5:51:23 PM |
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marshgrass
Senior Member
1422 Posts |
Posted - 03/23/2012 : 6:25:51 PM
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I don't think the Council admin are the bad guys. Cupka should let let someone else have his position. Of course we all know ther is no science. The Council is between a rock and a hard place. No science and a poorly thought out law. Bottom line, we need a new LAW!!
The guys are not bad people on the Council admin. However it is clear some have been on too long (Cupka). We need new blood. However, some of the other Councils are horrendous!!!! Ours measures very favorably compared to them.
Marsha
35 Contender |
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skinneej
Prolific Poster
11907 Posts |
Posted - 03/23/2012 : 8:04:37 PM
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Marsha, I don't think that they are bad people. I just think that they have a pre-conceived notion of how the fishery should be run. I believe that they want to get rid of individual species limits all together. I think that they want one HUGE closed area (like the one they tried to grab at the onset of the red snapper scam) that they can grow and shrink (tune) as necessary. In other words, they want to restrict access to 80% of the available fishing grounds and let the anglers have a free for all outside of that 80% (i.e. keep what you want because at most you can only wipe out the other 20%). I believe that they think that the only way to manage the bottom fishery is these big "Ecosystem Based" approaches. It's a new paradigm in the fishery that they want to push. They want to be famous scientists that solved a problem (that really didn't exist in the first place). I have no doubt that their intentions are truly to manage the fishery (as well as make a name for themselves in the scientific communtiy)... The problem is, they try to sell us their solutions as the only viable solution and it's a bold face lie. It's a purposeful deception of the highest form...
The only problem with that is that this is NOT an objective approach. They have started out with an answer and then use the data to try to push the public towards their already crafted solution. That's not science. That's a grand manipulation of the truth...
And the problem with these two is that they are "influencers" in the group. A master manipulator knows how to frame a problem (i.e. false dilemma) to get you to choose their desired answer on your own terms. I've literally worked with 100's of large corporations and the same pattern exists everywhere -- only 10% of the people really know what is going on and the other 90% of the people are just lemmings that play follow the leader off the cliff...
Again, they are "scientists", NOT engineers. If I want to build a bridge, I don't call a scientist, I call an engineer. All I want from a "scientist" is to report the facts in an objective manner, then let a real engineer actually solve the problem. They have lied to us and are trying to convince the world that the only way to regulate a fishery is through closures and restrictions. That couldn't be further from the truth.
So yes, they are not bad people, unless you consider peope who lie and manipulate the truth, and self-serve for their own benefit, bad people...
Anyway to all, keep fighting... Their grand plan is to screw up our laws so bad with all of these stupid regulations that they will end up with a "book" of regulations. Their goal is to frustrate the hell out of you until you BEG them for an ecosystem based approach. Don't fall for it. Don't be the dumbass that they want you to be...
And by the way, they have an ecosystem based approach in the bahamas. You can keep 18 pelagics of any kind and only 60lbs of bottomfish PER BOAT (not per angler, PER BOAT). That's 3 grouper if you do the math... Is their fishery any better than ours? Not a chance. Our fishery in Charleston blows the bahamas away... Don't fall for the master scam... |
Edited by - skinneej on 03/23/2012 8:13:52 PM |
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lynnmcd
Captain
3853 Posts |
Posted - 03/23/2012 : 8:08:35 PM
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I feel that they ARE BAD!! And, they need a ride to the stream!! 
"Miss Amanda"
-KeyWest
-Bluewater 2020CC
-Yammy F-150
www.joinrfa.orgGod is GOOD!! ALL the time!!
The shortest distance between a problem and a solution is the distance between your knees and the floor.
The one who kneels to the Lord can stand up to anything.
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Mazacuaton
Captain
.JPG)
181 Posts |
Posted - 03/23/2012 : 10:27:42 PM
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| Screw all of these regulations. In cuba you can not have a pig or catch a lobster. Farmers starved to death under Stalin. |
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Redstripe
Senior Member
2983 Posts |
Posted - 03/24/2012 : 10:19:25 PM
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| There are regulations...? Dang. I thought you could keep and eat whatever you wanted. |
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Redstripe
Senior Member
2983 Posts |
Posted - 03/24/2012 : 10:48:49 PM
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| There are regulations...? Dang. I thought you could keep and eat whatever you wanted. |
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sshaarda
Senior Member
3335 Posts |
Posted - 03/25/2012 : 08:25:16 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by lynnmcd
I feel that they ARE BAD!! And, they need a ride to the stream!!
"Miss Amanda"
-KeyWest
-Bluewater 2020CC
-Yammy F-150
www.joinrfa.orgGod is GOOD!! ALL the time!!
The shortest distance between a problem and a solution is the distance between your knees and the floor.
The one who kneels to the Lord can stand up to anything.
I'd give them a one way ride out. 
"If the Arabs put down their weapons today, there would be no more violence. If the Jews put down their weapons today, there would be no more Israel ." Benjamin Netanyahu
Ecclesiastes 10:2
GW 205
F200 Yam |
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lynnmcd
Captain
3853 Posts |
Posted - 03/25/2012 : 1:07:17 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by sshaarda
quote:
Originally posted by lynnmcd
I feel that they ARE BAD!! And, they need a ride to the stream!!
"Miss Amanda"
-KeyWest
-Bluewater 2020CC
-Yammy F-150
www.joinrfa.orgGod is GOOD!! ALL the time!!
The shortest distance between a problem and a solution is the distance between your knees and the floor.
The one who kneels to the Lord can stand up to anything.
I'd give them a one way ride out.
"If the Arabs put down their weapons today, there would be no more violence. If the Jews put down their weapons today, there would be no more Israel ." Benjamin Netanyahu
Ecclesiastes 10:2
GW 205
F200 Yam
HA! Notice, I didn't mention anything about a return trip!! 
"Miss Amanda"
-KeyWest
-Bluewater 2020CC
-Yammy F-150
www.joinrfa.orgGod is GOOD!! ALL the time!!
The shortest distance between a problem and a solution is the distance between your knees and the floor.
The one who kneels to the Lord can stand up to anything.
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SAFMC Coming after Triggerfish?
